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tell us about this attention that erupted in benghazi. it did not actually happen in tripoli. are you in tripoli. how are people responding to what has taken place? >> well, the situation here in tripoli does seem to be normal. people are on the streets. there seems to be nothing but the news that -- of what happened in bengazy spreading across tripoli today. most of the people i have token to, people in the capital here, are shocked and saddened by this attack. they say that it does not reflect the way libyans treat their guests. this is not the way libyans feel about the united states, and they do appreciate and do express gratitude for the rule the united states played last year as part of the nato alliance in helping the libyan people in ousting mow har gadhafi during their revolution. we are hearing also from government officials who are condemning this. they're also promising to bring those responsible to justice to have an investigation into what actually happened and who is responsible for this attack. >> i want to play a bit of sound here. this is from a libyan govern
tell us about this attention that erupted in benghazi. it did not actually happen in tripoli. are you in tripoli. how are people responding to what has taken place? >> well, the situation here in tripoli does seem to be normal. people are on the streets. there seems to be nothing but the news that -- of what happened in bengazy spreading across tripoli today. most of the people i have token to, people in the capital here, are shocked and saddened by this attack. they say that it does not...
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Sep 28, 2012
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there are also other demonstrations also in benghazi. but he said that a senior libyan security official in tripoli told his mission that they were worried about the possibility of these protests turning violent tomorrow. but, anderson, these are not anti-american or anti-western protests. they are protests, a continuation of what we saw in benghazi last friday, people taking to the streets, putting pressure on the government to disband militias and create security forces. they actually protest against extremism, but we did see these protests turn violent last friday, and there is that concern that could happen tomorrow in tripoli. we did see the u.s. embassy this evening posting on its website a warning for u.s. citizens in tripoli and in benghazi who remain in country to avoid the two main squares in these cities because of these demonstrations, saying that while they are expected to be peaceful protests, that they can be unpredictable and could turn violent. >> and, bob, as i said earlier, we heard leon panetta, the defense secretary,
there are also other demonstrations also in benghazi. but he said that a senior libyan security official in tripoli told his mission that they were worried about the possibility of these protests turning violent tomorrow. but, anderson, these are not anti-american or anti-western protests. they are protests, a continuation of what we saw in benghazi last friday, people taking to the streets, putting pressure on the government to disband militias and create security forces. they actually protest...
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Sep 27, 2012
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our third story, benghazi gate. there is a deep disconnect in washington over what happened the nikt ambassador chris stevens was killed. today, leon panetta stepped in to the fray, finally using the t word. >> the reason i think pretty clearly it was a terrorist attack because a group of terrorists obviously conducted that attack on the consulate. and against our individuals. >> clearly, a terrorist attack. now, panetta stopped short of saying which terrorist group was specifically responsible, but for two weeks, the white house and state department have refrained from blaming terrorists directly and when hillary clinton started to ame al-qaeda, the state department backed off. here she is in the u.n. meeting we reported on last night connecting al-qaeda linked groups to what she called the tragic attack. >> for some time, al-qaeda in the islamic mag and other groups have launched attacks and kid p kidnappings to other countries and are working with other extremists to undermine the transitions in north africa as w
our third story, benghazi gate. there is a deep disconnect in washington over what happened the nikt ambassador chris stevens was killed. today, leon panetta stepped in to the fray, finally using the t word. >> the reason i think pretty clearly it was a terrorist attack because a group of terrorists obviously conducted that attack on the consulate. and against our individuals. >> clearly, a terrorist attack. now, panetta stopped short of saying which terrorist group was specifically...
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as we tragically saw in benghazi. after our show, the state department backtracked saying clinton was speaking generally about al-qaeda, which is why it is important to tell you what we have confirmed tonight. a senior u.s. official tells cnn that u.s. intelligence knew the benghazi attack was the work of extremists affiliated with or inspired by al-qaeda and they knew this within 24 hours of the attack. something does not add up. if u.s. intelligence knew al-qaeda linked groups were involved, why didn't the secretary of state or the white house say so? if not to the public, at least in the briefings they've prouded to intelligence committee members in congress? voters also don't seem to think the handing of the attacks adds up. when bloomberg asked who would be tougher on terrorism, mitt romney came out on top, 48% to 42%. and the administration is facing criticism. bob corker is one of them and he is "outfront" tonight. appreciate your taking the time. now, i know you have written a letter and you, sir, have asked f
as we tragically saw in benghazi. after our show, the state department backtracked saying clinton was speaking generally about al-qaeda, which is why it is important to tell you what we have confirmed tonight. a senior u.s. official tells cnn that u.s. intelligence knew the benghazi attack was the work of extremists affiliated with or inspired by al-qaeda and they knew this within 24 hours of the attack. something does not add up. if u.s. intelligence knew al-qaeda linked groups were involved,...
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Sep 16, 2012
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if they are as wrong in their security estimate of iran as they were about the consulate in benghazi, we are in serious trouble. >> let me turn you back to the economy since it remains the issue number one. when you look at -- i'm sorry, a "the new york times" cbs poll about the probable electorate. the question, which candidate would do a better job handling the economy and unemployment. president obama, 47, mitt romney, 46. your candidate has lost the edge when it comes to the economy. if the economy is as bad as republicans have told us it is, what is holding mitt romney back here? from your description of the economy, others' description of the economy, this should be a president that doesn't have a chance, and yet he is beating mitt romney. >> there's no such thing as incumbent president doesn't have a chance. having the presidency is an enormous advantage. the president used it well. they have done a good job, unfair, raising questions about mitt romney and paul ryan, and romney-ryan has to overcome that. if you look at the fundamentals, 43 months of unemployment of 8 plus. no p
if they are as wrong in their security estimate of iran as they were about the consulate in benghazi, we are in serious trouble. >> let me turn you back to the economy since it remains the issue number one. when you look at -- i'm sorry, a "the new york times" cbs poll about the probable electorate. the question, which candidate would do a better job handling the economy and unemployment. president obama, 47, mitt romney, 46. your candidate has lost the edge when it comes to the...
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mission in benghazi, libya. even though the administration initially and repeatedly denied that assault was terrorism, it was at the same time working with the assumption that it was just that. in the investigation that we hear is ongoing, not a single f.b.i. agent has been to the consulate on benghazi, because of security concerns. those are just some of the new and shocking information we have for you tonight on the rapidly evolving story. here is chief intelligence correspondent catherine herridge. >> reporter: two sources tell fox news that within 24 hours of the assault on the u.s. compound in benghazi, the evidence pointed to a terrorist attack carried out by al-qaeda. the u.s. intelligence community had strong leads to indicate the affiliate in north africa, working with a second group that ceased to establish islamic state. "no one believes that mortars and the rpgs were work of mob. no one. " >> it was a terrorist attack. >> reporter: asked when he reached the conclusion the defense secretary was vague.
mission in benghazi, libya. even though the administration initially and repeatedly denied that assault was terrorism, it was at the same time working with the assumption that it was just that. in the investigation that we hear is ongoing, not a single f.b.i. agent has been to the consulate on benghazi, because of security concerns. those are just some of the new and shocking information we have for you tonight on the rapidly evolving story. here is chief intelligence correspondent catherine...
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they've never made it to benghazi. >> they haven't been on the ground in benghazi? >> they have not. in fact, it was taking so long to get permission to get into tripoli, the fbi deployed closer. they have conducted interviews of those in labia at the time of the attack, but not been able to get -- they've gotten as far as tripoli, but never gotten to benghazi. they made a request that the crime scene be security. as we know from arwa damon's reporting and other public reporting, the state department, we don't know whether the state department put that request to the libyans and whether it was denied. what we know for sure is the crime scene was never secured. the senior law enforcement official i spoke to said, if we get there now, it's not clear it will be of any use to us. the third and really critical and astonishing point to me that they made was, look, one of the things we have to do is question the individuals the libyans have in custody to get to the bottom of this, to understand what they're learning. in fact, they made request through the state department.
they've never made it to benghazi. >> they haven't been on the ground in benghazi? >> they have not. in fact, it was taking so long to get permission to get into tripoli, the fbi deployed closer. they have conducted interviews of those in labia at the time of the attack, but not been able to get -- they've gotten as far as tripoli, but never gotten to benghazi. they made a request that the crime scene be security. as we know from arwa damon's reporting and other public reporting,...
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Sep 15, 2012
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there are well-equipped groups already in place in benghazi. a lot of al qaeda sympathizers there as well, these pockets of al qaeda sympathizers. knowledge of this film, when you pull the pieces together, you get a little bit clearer image of what u.s. intelligence officials are working with new as they are trying to piece together exactly how this got so out of control. >> there has also been a lot of conflicting statements from washington as to whether this attack was planned or not. it seems to change daily. what do we know at this point? >> reporter: it does. as a matter of fact, it was very difficult sort of pinning down where the confusion was coming from. i mean, take a listen, randi, to just what was said as recently as last night. >> you know, we have no information to suggest that it was a pre-planned attack. >> this was a calculated act of terror on the part of a small group of jihadist >> reporter: now, of course, we have officials in libya also coming out and saying that they do believe this was pre-planned so here's where i think
there are well-equipped groups already in place in benghazi. a lot of al qaeda sympathizers there as well, these pockets of al qaeda sympathizers. knowledge of this film, when you pull the pieces together, you get a little bit clearer image of what u.s. intelligence officials are working with new as they are trying to piece together exactly how this got so out of control. >> there has also been a lot of conflicting statements from washington as to whether this attack was planned or not....
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at the benghazi. this after the united states, the nato allies, many in the arab world and moderate arab states worked together to get rid of gadhafi in libya and to see the attack on a mission in benghazi, that's way beyond politics, carol. this is a huge national security issue that's developed and goes to underscore that in these kinds of presidential debates when everyone is focusing on domestic issues, economic issues, the jobs related issues and domestic social issues that a national security crisis and this is a crisis right now can explode. you got what's going on in ben zba ga zi in libya right now. you got what's going on in cairo. american flags are burned. and it's a dangerous situation. this is one of the largest diplomatic missions that the united states has in the world. a lot of americans serving at the u.s. embassy in cairo. that's where they distribute more than $1.5 billion a year in u.s. economic and military assistance. mostly military assistance to egypt. but all that very much u
at the benghazi. this after the united states, the nato allies, many in the arab world and moderate arab states worked together to get rid of gadhafi in libya and to see the attack on a mission in benghazi, that's way beyond politics, carol. this is a huge national security issue that's developed and goes to underscore that in these kinds of presidential debates when everyone is focusing on domestic issues, economic issues, the jobs related issues and domestic social issues that a national...
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Sep 16, 2012
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i have been to libya and walked the streets of benghazi myself, and despite what we saw in that horrific incident where some mob was hijacked ultimately by a handful of extremists, the united states is extremely popular in libya and the outpouring of sympathy and support for ambassador stevens and his colleagues from the government and from people as evidence of that, the fact is, candy, that this is a turbulent time. it's a time of dramatic change. it's a change that the united states has backed because we understand tt when democracy takes root, when human rights and people's freedom of expression can be manifested, it may lead to turbulence in the short-term, but over the long-term, that is in the interest of the united states. the mobs we've seen on the outside of these embassies are small minority. they're the ones who have largely lost in these emerging democratic processes, and just as the people of these countries are not going to allow their lives to be hijacked by a dictator, they're not going to allow an extremist mob to hijack their future and their freedom, and we're going t
i have been to libya and walked the streets of benghazi myself, and despite what we saw in that horrific incident where some mob was hijacked ultimately by a handful of extremists, the united states is extremely popular in libya and the outpouring of sympathy and support for ambassador stevens and his colleagues from the government and from people as evidence of that, the fact is, candy, that this is a turbulent time. it's a time of dramatic change. it's a change that the united states has...
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we have reaction to the new intelligence report that the benghazi attack that killed four americans was an act of terror. >>> abortion, gun policy, the war on drugs. some of these social issues in
we have reaction to the new intelligence report that the benghazi attack that killed four americans was an act of terror. >>> abortion, gun policy, the war on drugs. some of these social issues in
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this was their work benghazi and this is the work we will carry on. >> president obama today talking of the mission that so many americans do and what four americans died doing. we put them front and center tonight. ambassador christopher stevens, sean smith, glen doherty and tyrone woods. joining me on the phone is ambassador stevens' stepfather. i am so sorry for your loss and please extend our condolences to your entire family. what do you want people to know about your stepson? >> well, i think what you learn today, it tells me what his legacy was at the anderson air force base when the caskets were brought back, 800 members of the state department were there and the president for the first time he spoke at one of these ceremonial dignified transfers and secretary clinton spoke and they all expressed the understanding that chris's commitment to libya and to the country has left a legacy that will live after him. so this is what i'd like people to know, that he was beloved by his colleagues in the state department and from the people of libya. the libya ambassador came and spoke t
this was their work benghazi and this is the work we will carry on. >> president obama today talking of the mission that so many americans do and what four americans died doing. we put them front and center tonight. ambassador christopher stevens, sean smith, glen doherty and tyrone woods. joining me on the phone is ambassador stevens' stepfather. i am so sorry for your loss and please extend our condolences to your entire family. what do you want people to know about your stepson?...
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one senator is calling it benghazi gait. the growing questions about the killings of four americans in libya and how the white house characterized it from the days since. we'll have reaction from the former white house chief of stop andy card. >> al qaeda sacks an embassy and kills an ambassador. the administration didn't want to admit it. the administration thinking if it stringt out long enough the media would let it slide. [ male announcer ] sponges take your mark. [ female announcer ] one drop of ultra daw has twice the everyday grease cleaning ingredients of one drop of the leading non-concentrated brand... to clean 2x more greasy dishes. dawn does more. so it's not a chore. megyn: 2:31 in the east. back to our top story. several deputy kralts on the senate foreign relations committee have joined republicans sending a lower the state department asking what kind of intelligence we had prior to the attack on four americans in benghazi. the administration blamed that attack on a protest that got out of hand. a story questi
one senator is calling it benghazi gait. the growing questions about the killings of four americans in libya and how the white house characterized it from the days since. we'll have reaction from the former white house chief of stop andy card. >> al qaeda sacks an embassy and kills an ambassador. the administration didn't want to admit it. the administration thinking if it stringt out long enough the media would let it slide. [ male announcer ] sponges take your mark. [ female announcer ]...
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they operate in and around the area of benghazi. the gentleman you are referring to was released from guantanamo and he was the one who started it and sharia. he was involved in it. >> i'm looking at a document from guantanamo guantanamo bay, and it's all about the released detainee says he's an associate of bin laden in and the government himself considers him a dangerous man with no calms will committing crist attacks. and he's medium to high risk as he's likely to pose a threat to u.s. interest and its allies. we released him and why did we send him to libya thinking they would keep him forever? >> we shouldn't have. it's the same thing we saw in iraq for the gentleman who was responsible for the kidnapping and killing of five soldiers. the iraqis and released him, as well. you see failed policies coming from this administration about foreign policy detain epolicy and on national security. >> he was released in 2007. not during this administration. but i'm curious wouldn't you have expected that we would have monitored him? >> yo
they operate in and around the area of benghazi. the gentleman you are referring to was released from guantanamo and he was the one who started it and sharia. he was involved in it. >> i'm looking at a document from guantanamo guantanamo bay, and it's all about the released detainee says he's an associate of bin laden in and the government himself considers him a dangerous man with no calms will committing crist attacks. and he's medium to high risk as he's likely to pose a threat to u.s....
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security have been tighter at that consulate given the history of terror activity in benghazi? >>guest: obviously we did have a strong security presence and, unfortunately, two of the four americans who died in benghazi were there to provide security. obviously it wasn't sufficient in the circumstances to prevent the overrun of the consulate. this is among the things that, obviously, will be looked at, as the investigation unfolds --. >>chris: could it have been stronger? >>guest: is why we have upped our presence in tripoli and other parts of the world. chris, we have to see what the assessment reveals. obviously, there was a significant security preparation defending our consulate and our other facility in benghazi and that did not prove sufficient to the moment. >>chris: ambassador rice, thank you very much for coming in today and discussing the fast-moving developments in that part of the world. >> next, the head of the house intelligence committee with the latest on who was behind the debtly attack on our >> chris: there are still more questions than answers about the >>ch
security have been tighter at that consulate given the history of terror activity in benghazi? >>guest: obviously we did have a strong security presence and, unfortunately, two of the four americans who died in benghazi were there to provide security. obviously it wasn't sufficient in the circumstances to prevent the overrun of the consulate. this is among the things that, obviously, will be looked at, as the investigation unfolds --. >>chris: could it have been stronger?...
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first to tell you that fbi investigators have not set foot in the ruins of the american consulate of benghazi, libya. tonight, we're the first it tell you why. the likely reason and from a top law enforcement official. four americans as you know were murdered in the assault, one american ambassador, christopher stevens, that was 2 1/2 weeks ago, 2 1/2 weeks, that saw the administration describe this first as a spontan
first to tell you that fbi investigators have not set foot in the ruins of the american consulate of benghazi, libya. tonight, we're the first it tell you why. the likely reason and from a top law enforcement official. four americans as you know were murdered in the assault, one american ambassador, christopher stevens, that was 2 1/2 weeks ago, 2 1/2 weeks, that saw the administration describe this first as a spontan
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benghazi is a city that we defended. how could we not have known that based on the instances that we are hearing about now that something might happen on 9/11? it was a massive failure of intelligence which is a possibility. the state department thought it was operate nothing a benign environment that it didn't need to gather intelligence and i am worried, it is more likely the latter explanation and it speaks to a world view that is flawed. ip supported overthrowing gaddafi once he threatened with terrorism. but who do you replace him? here 18 months after it started. the writ of the central government does not run country wide. there is it a risk of fralmentation and terrorist will take root in the meditarianium. and this is spreading in the region. and we don't understand what the risks are. president likes to say gaddafi is overturned without any american casulties. there is an un envoy to talk to president assaud. he killed 20,000, of his own people. does the un really think he will help us with this? >> the envoy m
benghazi is a city that we defended. how could we not have known that based on the instances that we are hearing about now that something might happen on 9/11? it was a massive failure of intelligence which is a possibility. the state department thought it was operate nothing a benign environment that it didn't need to gather intelligence and i am worried, it is more likely the latter explanation and it speaks to a world view that is flawed. ip supported overthrowing gaddafi once he threatened...
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benghazi is a city that we defended. how could we not have known that based on the instances that we are hearing about now that something might happen on 9/11? it was a massive failure of intelligence which is a possibility. the state department thought it was operate nothing a benign environment that it didn't need to gather intelligence and i am worried, it is more likely the latter explanation and it speaks to a world view that is flawed. ip supported overthrowing gaddafi once he threatened with terrorism. but who do you replace him? here 18 months after it started. the writ of the central government does not run country wide. there is it a risk of fralmentation and terrorist will take root in the meditarianium. and this is spreading in the region. and we don't understand what the risks are. president likes to say gaddafi is overturned without any american casulties. there is an un envoy to talk to president assaud. he killed 20,000, of his own people. does the un really think he will help us with this? >> the envoy m
benghazi is a city that we defended. how could we not have known that based on the instances that we are hearing about now that something might happen on 9/11? it was a massive failure of intelligence which is a possibility. the state department thought it was operate nothing a benign environment that it didn't need to gather intelligence and i am worried, it is more likely the latter explanation and it speaks to a world view that is flawed. ip supported overthrowing gaddafi once he threatened...
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first of all, we had no actionable intelligence to suggest that any attack on our facility in benghazi was imminent. in cairo, we did have indications that there was the risk that the video might spark some protests, and our embassy, in fact, acted accordingly, and had called upon the egyptian authorities to reinforce our facility. what we have seen with respect to the security response, obviously, we had security personnel in benghazi, a significant number, and tragically, among those four that were killed were two of our security personnel. but what happened, obviously, overwhelmed the security we had in place, which is why the president ordered additional reinforcements to tripoli and why elsewhere in the world we have been working with governments to ensure they take up their obligations to protect us and we reinforce where necessary. >> the president and secretary of state have talked about a mob mentality. that's my words, not their words, but they talked about the tyranny of mobs. operating in this part of the world. here is the reality. if you look at foreign aid, u.s. direct f
first of all, we had no actionable intelligence to suggest that any attack on our facility in benghazi was imminent. in cairo, we did have indications that there was the risk that the video might spark some protests, and our embassy, in fact, acted accordingly, and had called upon the egyptian authorities to reinforce our facility. what we have seen with respect to the security response, obviously, we had security personnel in benghazi, a significant number, and tragically, among those four...
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eastern time, a gunman attacked the american consulate in benghazi resulting in including the ambassador, christopher stevens. >> this should shock people of all faiths around the world. >> at 10:09 p.m. our time, romney issued a statement saying it it was disgraceful the obama 's administration what -- not was to condemn attacks but sympathize with those who made the attacks. they quoted the obama administration saying the statement was not cleared by washington and does not reflect the views of the united states government. jack tapper recorded the same statement on abc news. they said romney's political faux pas was to hurt the pundit class without thinking seriously about the problems for american in the world. do you believe that? >> no. this is all more rum -- war room bluster. you have to attack. something happens and you attack right away. it's mindless. i do not think it will stick. >> earlier in the week, you said you would have told him to go and help. any second thoughts? >> no second thoughts. i believe the time when you gave completely vindicates what romney did. you said t
eastern time, a gunman attacked the american consulate in benghazi resulting in including the ambassador, christopher stevens. >> this should shock people of all faiths around the world. >> at 10:09 p.m. our time, romney issued a statement saying it it was disgraceful the obama 's administration what -- not was to condemn attacks but sympathize with those who made the attacks. they quoted the obama administration saying the statement was not cleared by washington and does not...
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consulate in benghazi, libya. can you update us? >> it's my understanding there were nearly two dozen armed individuals that coordinated explosions and other things. this is the same site that was attacked with an ied about a month or so ago. very, very concerning, and it's concerning that this is a repeat target for them and that this may have been more successful because of the large scale of it. so it's, again, very, very concerning. we have seen al qaeda elements in libya spring up, as we have seen in tunisia, as well. all of that is concerning. we still don't know for certain yet, as i speak to you today or tonight, who is responsible and who's claimed responsibility. so those details are still unfolding. >> it is a coincidence or not that this is the anniversary of 9/11? and we see not only what's going on in libya, but they were attacking the u.s. embassy in cairo, as well on this day. is there a connection here? >> well, from what i have been led to believe as i stand here, there's no connection yet identified after the coor
consulate in benghazi, libya. can you update us? >> it's my understanding there were nearly two dozen armed individuals that coordinated explosions and other things. this is the same site that was attacked with an ied about a month or so ago. very, very concerning, and it's concerning that this is a repeat target for them and that this may have been more successful because of the large scale of it. so it's, again, very, very concerning. we have seen al qaeda elements in libya spring up,...
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let's go first to the issue of what is happening in cairo and benghazi and hopefully it will be contained there but these, this storming of our embassy, the burning of our consulate, this is not the stuff of an arab spring, is it? >> no this is radical islamic wave cresting in the middle east. and i think anybody who remembers the takeover of our embassy in tehran in 1979 has to be chilled at the picture of people standing on top of the walls of our embassy in cairo and reports that fire has damaged or destroyed the consulate in benghazi. we better be prepared for something worse coming in the next several days at a minimum. i think it is time to tell the government of egypt, their security forces could have prevented this and we expect them to be prepared the next time. lou: do you agree, judy? >> i'm afraid i do agree with john. often times we disagree. lou: the night is young. >> there can be absolutely no dispute that that is an attack on american soil. the egyptians have an obligation to protect the embassy. just as they had an obligation to protect the israeli embassy which they als
let's go first to the issue of what is happening in cairo and benghazi and hopefully it will be contained there but these, this storming of our embassy, the burning of our consulate, this is not the stuff of an arab spring, is it? >> no this is radical islamic wave cresting in the middle east. and i think anybody who remembers the takeover of our embassy in tehran in 1979 has to be chilled at the picture of people standing on top of the walls of our embassy in cairo and reports that fire...
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>> do you believe what took place in benghazi could have been anticipated? there are reports that there were, you know, security concerns that ambassador stevens had, that there was some activity of camps of extremists happening nearby. do you believe that the u.s. could have anticipated that the u.s. consulate would be a target? >> you know, the only responsible answer i can give you is that i don't know, and i'm not sure that anyone yet knows. it was a very volatile situation into which an extremist murderous group interjected itself, but what was the relationship between that group and the larger crowd that was gathered, i don't know. >> is it your concern that's what's bubbling up around the globe in terms of various forms of unrest that this might be a prelude to something even bigger than what we've seen already? is that your concern? >> we have have toare in mind that we have to preserve our freedom of speech in this countr we should not be tolerant of what could be a conspiracy. a conspiracy involving multiple people with phony names or hidden identi
>> do you believe what took place in benghazi could have been anticipated? there are reports that there were, you know, security concerns that ambassador stevens had, that there was some activity of camps of extremists happening nearby. do you believe that the u.s. could have anticipated that the u.s. consulate would be a target? >> you know, the only responsible answer i can give you is that i don't know, and i'm not sure that anyone yet knows. it was a very volatile situation into...